Jo and Rob dance around danger to recap the third episode of Slow Horses Season 4. They open with a few more listener emails before discussing the dark backstory of Frank Harkness, the dynamic between Standish and David Cartwright, and why the blissfully ignorant Giti is quickly becoming one of the show’s most delightful characters (2:06). Along the way, they theorize about what’s going on with the mysterious J.K. Coe and how Bad Sam Chapman’s role in the story has grown season to season (29:42). Later, they introduce a brand-new segment called Spy Vs. Spy, where they point out some of the best (and worst) examples of spycraft in this week’s episode (42:32).
Hosts: Joanna Robinson and Rob Mahoney Producer: Kai Grady Additional Production Support: Justin Sayles
Editor’s note, September 17, 2024: This piece was originally published on August 20, 2019, when the seventh episode of Break Stuff: The Story of Woodstock ’99 was released. To mark the recent 25th anniversary of the festival, The Ringer is resurfacing Break Stuff on its own dedicated Spotify feed.
In 1999, a music festival in upstate New York became a social experiment. There were riots, looting, and numerous assaults, all set to a soundtrack of the era’s most aggressive rock bands. Incredibly, this was the third iteration of Woodstock, a festival originally known for peace, love, and hippie idealism. But Woodstock ’99 revealed some hard truths behind the myths of the 1960s and the danger that nostalgia can engender.
Below is an excerpt from the seventh episode of Break Stuff. Find the series here, and check back each Tuesday and Thursday through September 19 for new episodes.
By early Sunday morning, on Woodstock ’99’s final day, many attendees were still trying to sleep off the previous night’s partying. But the media people covering the festival were up with the sun. In the harsh light of day, Griffiss Air Force Base looked like a wasteland.
“We got there before anybody had started playing, before anybody had left their tents,” says Dave Holmes, an on-air host for MTV in 1999. “I got a photograph from the stage of the entire lawn, the main viewing area, and it was just a sea of trash and one single person face down asleep. Not on a sleeping bag, just on the grass. It was just him and a thousand hot dog wrappers and red Solo cups and napkins for as far as the eye can see. And that is my enduring image of Woodstock ’99.”
Rob Sheffield, who covered the festival for Rolling Stone, was also up early that morning, surveying the damage.
“Everybody was really pretty used up and burned out by Sunday morning,” he says. “I hadn’t done a drug all weekend and I felt like the wrath of God so I can just imagine how people who were literally hungover were feeling.
“I slept on a pile of pizza boxes. Pizza boxes were a very good surface to sleep on because pizza boxes are white. And, uh, because they’re white, you could tell if they’d been urinated on or not. Which makes them very very useful if you’re looking for something to sleep on. Because every flat surface there had been so thoroughly urinated on.”
The music on Saturday culminated with some of the loudest and most aggressive bands of the entire festival: Metallica, Rage Against the Machine, and Limp Bizkit. Sunday, however, started on a much different foot musically. Wearing sunglasses and his signature black hat, Willie Nelson attempted to bring a little mellowness back to the festival.
“His set begins with ‘Whiskey River,’” Sheffield says. “And that was one of the great musical moments of the weekend, ’cause I just remember everybody really kind of breathing a sigh of relief. Willie is going to take care of us. Willie is the smart sane adult in the room at this point—not the promoters, definitely not the security people.”
But the laid-back feeling Nelson brought to Woodstock ’99 was short-lived. Not long after Willie Nelson left the stage in clouds of marijuana smoke, another smart, sane adult—Elvis Costello—came out.
Now, I love Elvis Costello. I am a rock critic, after all. I think he’s one of the great singer-songwriters of the ’70s and ’80s. But Woodstock ’99 wasn’t exactly his crowd. In the video, you can see people throwing water bottles at Elvis before he’s even reached the chorus of his first song.
“Elvis Costello, he really tried, but he was with an acoustic guitar and was playing for the most part for a non–Elvis Costello–cultist kind of crowd,” Sheffield says. “He began with a deep cut from Spike, ‘Pads, Paws, and Claws,’ and it was just a preposterously bad performance that was self-indulgent in a rock star kind of way. It was just really kind of abrasive and aggravating for people. … The collective angst level of the crowd got a little uglier.”
The bad feeling that Rob picked up on during Elvis Costello’s set was also felt by Jake Hafner, a 23-year-old Syracuse man hired to work for the festival’s Peace Patrol. Jake and his fellow guards were already struggling to contend with a depleted security force. By Sunday, many of Jake’s coworkers had already been fired; others simply quit once they were inside the base in order to join the party. But when Jake showed up for his shift on Sunday afternoon, the tension in the air was even sharper and more intense.
“It would get a little closer to the edge every night,” he says. “By Sunday when we showed up for work we all knew collectively that something was going to happen that night. It was just in the air. You could just feel it.”
That feeling in the air might have just been sheer exhaustion. Many people were operating on very little sleep by then. During the previous night, security guards had given up on policing the campgrounds where many attendees stayed.
“They had stopped sending ambulances or cops into that area because as soon as they would enter in there they would just get pelted with rocks and mud and everything. It was kind of like a no man’s zone,” Hafner says. “So they stopped sending people in there altogether. And I believe that was where a lot of the really bad stuff happened.”
One member of Woodstock’s medical team who did venture into the campgrounds on Sunday morning was Dave Konig, an EMT.
“When you went through the campground, a little bit it reminded you of a refugee camp from the movies,” Konig says. “That there had been some sort of big battle and there’s just trash all over, things burnt all over from the night before, from whatever campfires had gone on. So you just saw that breakdown of both the structure and civility amongst people. Yeah, it was definitely palpable Sunday morning. But yet people still went to the stages.”
While most attendees were still able to maintain some semblance of sanity, Dave does remember encountering a man in the campgrounds who had clearly gone off the deep end. I say “clearly” because the man was completely naked and seemed like he was hopped up on some combination of drugs. He was so out of it that he was destroying every tent in sight.
Finally, one of Dave’s coworkers decided to intervene.
“I remember this guy stepped up to, to, this naked man,” Konig says. “He gave this guy a right hook like Muhammad Ali. He just hooked him so hard. The guy’s head snapped to the right. And then … he was like the Terminator—it just slowly turned back and then he looked at the guy who had just hit him and he was just like, ‘Rawr!’ And … everybody just tackled him at that point. We tackled him. We got him restrained, sedated, and brought him in.”
The rising tension was getting to MTV’s Holmes. Festival attendees had been abusive to the music channel’s hosts and camera crews since Friday. Someone even threw a bottle of urine at TRL host Carson Daly.
By Sunday, the MTV contingent was thoroughly rattled.
“Even before the rioting—that’s a fun way to start a sentence, even before the rioting—it seemed like this was not going to be remembered as a successful festival,” says Holmes. “When we got back to the Air Force base the next day, all anybody was talking about was how scared they were the night before. A lot of the cameramen and the production people were up in this tower that, like, could have been brought down like a scene from Game of Thrones in the middle of the show. People were understandably a little nervous that Sunday.”
That tension boiled over during a press conference in the afternoon. Someone from MTV confronted Woodstock ’99 promoter John Scher over the festival’s failure to control the most violent attendees:
“MTV News was forced to get off of home base, we felt it was too dangerous,” the reporter said. There were people throwing glass bottles everywhere. MTV tower people had to be evacuated.
“Calm down,” Scher responded.
“In all of the concerts I’ve seen, I have never seen anything quite so out of hand as this. It was violent, it was dangerous, it was hostile,” the reporter continued. “My question for you is why did no one from either security or the organization walk out to Fred Durst and say, ‘Man, can you ask these kids to chill?’ I talked to kids later who were petrified out there.”
The confrontation was a rare sour note for Scher at that point in the festival. As far as he and other organizers were concerned, Woodstock ’99 was going along swimmingly. All of the tensions that seemed obvious to those on the ground weren’t apparent to the people running the festival.
“Right after that, I took a walk from the press tent to the stage and this woman journalist, I can’t remember her name, but she walked and said, ‘Can we talk?’” Scher says now. “And at one point we stopped and she said, ‘This is unbelievable. This is the greatest thing. If you put this many people at any other kind of event, it never would have gone that well.’ She said it was just amazing. And then it all blew up over the next couple of hours.”
It turns out that the expectations were way out of whack. What was actually in the works was a candlelight vigil organized by an anti-gun group. By Sunday afternoon, they were handing out candles to attendees.
“And the peace candles became the kindling for the fires that became part of the riot,” says Brian Hiatt, a journalist who covered Woodstock ’99 and later did a yearlong investigation into the festival.
In his reporting, Hiatt discovered that attendees had been setting fires all over the grounds throughout the weekend. And yet nobody ever seemed to get in trouble for it.
“As they put out those fires, the attendees were already threatening to make more fire,” Hiatt says. “They said, ‘We’ll burn anything.’ The threats were, ‘You can’t stop us. If you stop us, it’ll start somewhere else.’”
As late afternoon turned into early evening, the crowd grew increasingly disgruntled and unruly. And then, one of the most popular rock bands of the era showed up on stage: Creed. At Woodstock ’99, they were received like rock royalty.
However, Creed guitarist Mark Tremonti remembers Woodstock ’99 as kind of a terrifying experience.
“Back then in ’99, we’d only been kind of a professional touring band for about two years, so I didn’t have the stage confidence that I have now,” he says. “So it was I just remember it being such a large and intimidating type of setting.”
Soon after Creed left the stage, Woodstock ’99 would descend into riots. But Tremonti can’t recall feeling any premonitions. After Creed it was time for that night’s big headliner—the Red Hot Chili Peppers. The band was riding high again that summer after years of inaction. The album Californication,which became the band’s best-selling record, came out the previous month.
Their performance was supposed to mark the festival’s triumphant climax. And the band was primed for the decadent atmosphere. No one more than Flea, who came out wearing his bass guitar … and no clothes.
Getty Images
“It seemed like they were playing very well,” Sheffield says. “It was really a beautiful Chili Peppers set. They were coming off Californication. They had the best songs of their career, and they were playing at the peak of their career. So it’s weirdly incongruous. That’s when the violence and the crowd got really, really ugly.”
After playing for about an hour, the Chili Peppers left the stage. Before they could come back for their planned encore, the chasm between the stage and the audience suddenly collapsed. John Scher himself came out to warn the audience.
“As you can see, if you look behind you, we have a bit of a problem,” he said.
The problem was a bonfire raging on the horizon. Actually, the word “bonfire” doesn’t do justice to this wild inferno. In a video posted on YouTube, it looks like a small cabin that’s been totally engulfed in flames. But in the chaotic context of Woodstock ’99, it didn’t seem out of place at first.
Even with part of the festival now on fire, the show didn’t immediately end. When the Chili Peppers came back out, singer Anthony Kiedis commented sardonically on the situation.
“Holy shit, it’s Apocalypse Now out there. Make way for the fire trucks!” he said
And then they proceeded to play a cover of “Fire” by Jimi Hendrix. I think that this was supposed to be part of the festival’s grand finale—a callback to one of the biggest stars of the original festival, coupled with the candlelight vigil that was now a full-on blaze.
Larry weighs in on the debate between Donald Trump and Kamala Harris. He’s then joined by producer Will Packer to discuss his new Peacock limited series Fight Night: The Million Dollar Heist. They begin their conversation by discussing the premise and history behind the project, which leads to a discussion about the art of creating content in today’s entertainment industry (12:57). After the break, Larry and Will shine a light on the artistic way Don Cheadle, Kevin Hart, Terrence Howard, and Samuel L. Jackson embody their individual characters in Fight Night, which tells the story of a heist that took place at a Muhammad Ali boxing match (37:52). Finally, Will talks about his journey to becoming one of Hollywood’s top producers and shares some sage advice for aspiring filmmakers (56:06).
Host: Larry Wilmore Guest: Will Packer Producer: Chris Sutton
This week, Dave, Neil, and Joanna debate the best on-screen mobster! They start by talking about the history of mobster movies and what they love about them (10:04). Then, they get into pretrial awards and dismissals (28:29). Later, they reveal each of their top three choices and listen to some of your picks to figure out which four should make it to the final poll (40:18).
Now it’s up to you to decide! Who is the best on-screen mobster? You can vote for the winner at TheRinger.com, on The Ringer’s X feed, and in the Spotify app, where you’ll find Trial by Content. The winner will be announced on the next episode!
You can send your picks for the next topic and a few sentences to support your pick to TrialByContent@gmail.com. You can also submit suggestions for future Trial by Content topics. Is there a great pop culture debate that you’d like us to settle? Send it on over!
For a list of all the movies discussed on this week’s episode and a preview of what is to come on Trial by Content, head on over to Letterboxd.com/TrialByContent and follow us there!
Hosts: Dave Gonzales, Joanna Robinson, and Neil Miller Associate Producer: Carlos Chiriboga Additional Production Supervision: Arjuna Ramgopal Theme Song and Other Music Credits: Devon Renaldo
Of all the disturbing media that was at our disposal in the ’90s – from Are You Afraid of the Dark to Unsolved Mysteries – Goosebumps is the series that has truly stuck with me.
I read as many of the R.L. Stine books as I possibly could. Anytime we took a trip to Barnes & Noble I would beg my parents for money to grab one for more for my collection.
So when the T.V. series premiered in 1995, I was beyond thrilled. But after all these years, I never truly realized how deeply terrifying and messed up the monsters actually were for a kid’s show. I’ve compiled this epic list of the creepiest villains from the Goosebumps series. And now I need to call my therapist.
Chelsea Stark-Jones and Callie Curry begin today’s Morally Corrupt by sharing their reactions to the newly dropped trailer for Season 9 of The Real Housewives of Potomac and other recent goings-on in Bravoland (2:30). Then, they move on to recap Season 18, Episode 10 of The Real Housewives of Orange County (12:40) and part 1 of The Real Housewives of Dubai Season 2 reunion (30:20).
Hosts: Mallory Rubin and Joanna Robinson Producer: Steve Ahlman Video Editor: Cameron Dinwiddie Additional Production: Arjuna Ramgopal and John Richter Social: Jomi Adeniran
Mike and Jesse kick off the show with breaking news: Topps has significantly expanded its Disney partnership to include Pixar, Marvel, and Star Wars card rights. They break down how this move will reshape the card industry and address the troubling rise in theft within the card community (3:00). Later, they welcome Nick Andrews, also known as the Boston Card Hunter, to talk about the pros and cons of using CT scans in card collecting and the ethical issues it presents (18:00).
Hosts: Mike Gioseffi and Jesse Gibson Guest: Nick Andrews Producer: Devon Renaldo
Johnny is joined by friend and castmate Jordan Wiseley to discuss being disliked by other castmates, strategy, the toxic effects of social media on the game, and more
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It’s fall festival season! Matt is joined by Peter Kujawski, the chairman of Focus Features, to discuss the science of premiering a movie at a film festival. Peter provides his expertise on why you bring a certain movie to a certain festival, the risk involved, and which specific festivals are best suited for certain types of films. They also discuss the politics of these festivals jockeying to attain the world premieres of splashy titles, and which festival award is the most coveted (02:51). Matt ends the show with an opening weekend box office prediction for Beetlejuice Beetlejuice (26:10).
For a 20 percent discount on Matt’s Hollywood insider newsletter, What I’m Hearing …, click here.
Rachel admits to feeling sorry for Shannon during a breakdown of Season 18, Episode 9 of ‘The Real Housewives of Orange County,’ and Rachel and Chelsea talk about the Season 2 finale of ‘The Real Housewives of Dubai’
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There’s a video I return to often. Posted just over 10 years ago by an essentially defunct blog called Houston Hip-Hop Fix, it shows Rich Homie Quan in a blue Argentina soccer kit and at least five necklaces. Quan and the interviewer are bathed off and on in the strobing red light of a cop car. There’s one microphone, so Quan and the host step on one another’s thoughts, deferring politely and shrugging apologies. The rapper runs through the sort of light mythmaking that marks all these interviews: Yes, the debut album is coming; no, no more free mixtapes; yes, music runs through my veins; no, I never touch pen to paper.
About 90 seconds into the clip, Quan starts talking about his relationship with Young Thug. He says they have unique chemistry in the studio, more boilerplate stuff. But a minute later––after a clumsy jump cut in the video—Quan says that he and Thug are going to release an EP. Most definitely, the interviewer says. Any plans on when that’s gonna drop? “Before the year’s out,” Quan replies. The interviewer asks whether he’d be willing to reveal the title. Quan declines, but he strokes his goatee, looks for a second into the camera––something he hasn’t done to this point––and raps his hand on the interviewer’s forearm for emphasis. “I can tell you this,” he says. “The EP me and Thug [are going to] drop? The hardest duo since Outkast.” The interviewer’s eyes widen. He starts to push back (“Now that’s—”), but Quan cuts him off. “I’m not being funny.” He presses. “I’m not putting too much on it. Hardest duo since Outkast.”
Quan, who passed away Thursday, one month before his 34th birthday, was always doing this: cocooning the audacious within a thick layer of charm and humility. He was a born hitmaker whose commercial career was compromised by record label issues, contractual lawsuits, and the industry’s uneven evolution over the course of the 2010s. Like Dre, Big Boi, and a host of other Southern pioneers, Quan wrote songs that smartly synthesized formal experimentation and personal introspection—with each new, clipped flow or harmonized aside, he seemed to burrow deeper into his own psyche. He leaves behind four sons.
Quan was born Dequantes Devontay Lamar in 1990 and was raised in Atlanta, where, as a teenager, he excelled as a center fielder and student of literature. He was less successful in a short-lived burglary career, which led to a 15-month bid shortly after he dropped out of Fort Valley State University. “It really sat me down and opened my eyes,” Quan told XXLof his time inside.
The first things you’d notice about his music were the titles. In 2012, Quan released his first mixtape, I Go In on Every Song, a promise on which it very nearly delivers. Early the following year, he earned his national breakthrough on the back of “Type of Way,” which made him sound a little mean and a little sensitive, and also like he nearly drowned in a vat of charisma as a small child. (That single was issued to iTunes by Def Jam, which seemed to indicate that Quan had signed to the label; in fact, he would remain locked in litigation with a smaller company, Think It’s a Game Entertainment, for many years.)
“Type of Way” came out as Future was pulling rap radio into his orbit, and it was seen by some early listeners as a variation on that Plutonic style. But in its verses, Quan skews much closer to traditional modes of rapping, using his melodic skills to augment the song rather than anchor it. It functions as an extended taunt—sometimes menacing, other times merely playful. Boasts that he can spot undercover cops with a single glance enjamb against lines like “I got a hideaway, and I go there sometimes / To give my mind a break”; memories of served subpoenas are delivered in delicate singsong. All of this knottiness and seeming contradiction is in fact corralled by Quan until it propels the song in a single direction with irrepressible momentum.
There were more titles, more hits: Still Goin In, the Gucci Mane collaboration Trust God Fuck 12, I Promise I Will Never Stop Going In. “Walk Thru,” a duet with the Compton rapper Problem (now Jason Martin), is a slick song about collecting inflated club appearance fees that nevertheless sounds like it was spawned in a nightmare. The hook he gifted to YG in 2013 helped get the regional star off the shelf at Def Jam and onto national radio for the first time. And in 2015, when he went triple platinum with his single “Flex (Ooh, Ooh, Ooh),” he did so by distilling his style more cleanly than ever before. That song is wobbly and joyous, making rote descriptions of money earned sound like tiny spiritual breakthroughs.
All the while, his early collaborator was on his own star trajectory. Both Thug and Quan were dogged by conservative reactions to their work. It would be a couple of years before “mumble rap” was in wide use as a pejorative, but they were, predictably, seen by some resistant listeners as uninteresting writers or inadequate vocalists. Both charges were and are rooted in ideological opposition to their styles rather than earnest evaluations of their music. But even for the initiated, Quan’s suggestion that whatever he and Thug were working on would cement them as better than the Clipse or Black Star, better than Webbie and Boosie or Dead Prez or whomever, seemed improbable.
What they delivered, in September 2014, was at once bigger and smaller than anyone could have expected, seismic but nearly invisible. The tour that Tha Tour, Pt. 1 was meant to promote never really materialized; some of the Cash Money albums teased during DJ drops would be held up in labyrinthine court cases for another half decade, if they were released at all. The terrible, sub–Microsoft Paint cover dubbed the group Rich Gang, a moniker that had already been used for Baby’s other post–Cash Money branding exercises. “Lifestyle,” the massive summer hit Thug and Quan had scored under the name, wasn’t even included. Tha Tour does not exist on streaming platforms and did not spawn any new hits. But it was as Quan promised: a perfect snapshot of two eccentrics searching manically for new veins to tap. The hardest duo since Outkast.
You could credibly argue that Tha Tour is the best rap record of the 2010s. It captures Thug, one of the decade’s true supernova talents, near or at his apex—yet it would be very reasonable to suggest that Quan gets the better of him. See Quan’s verse on the shimmering “Flava,” where he shouts, buoyant, about his son inheriting his features, then makes the act of allowing a girlfriend to count his money seem more tender than any other intimate moment. Or take the harrowing “Freestyle,” its title belying the depth of thought and passion that Quan brings to the song. “My baby mama just put me on child support,” he raps:
Fuck a warrant, I ain’t going to court Don’t care what them white folks say, I just wanna see my lil boy Go to school, be a man, and sign up for college, boy Don’t be a fool, be a man, what you think that knowledge for?
On Thursday, shortly after Quan’s passing was confirmed, Quavo, one of the two surviving members of Migos, posted an Instagram story. “Good Convo With My Bro,” he wrote over a black background, and tagged Offset, with whom he’d been locked in a very public feud since shortly before their group mate Takeoff was killed in November 2022. Ten years ago, it seemed this cohort of Atlanta rappers was going to rule the industry indefinitely; today, the deaths of artists including Quan, Takeoff, Trouble, Lil Keed, and Bankroll Fresh—as well as Young Thug’s ongoing RICO trial—hang like a dark cloud over one of music’s creative meccas.
After “Flex,” Quan’s career ceased to be supported as it could or should have been by record companies; whether because of the Think It’s a Game situation, bad taste, or a lack of marketing imagination, he never again got the push he deserved. (He also never worked with Thug again: In interviews about the topic, Quan was reflective and self-critical, though some of the particulars of their falling-out may now be the concern of the Georgia justice system.) His best solo album, 2017’s thoughtful, technically virtuosic Back to the Basics, was swallowed entirely by Kendrick Lamar’s DAMN, which was surprise released on the same day.
The 2019 film Uncut Gems is typical of its directors’ output. Josh and Benny Safdie are obsessed with verisimilitude—even their most outlandish scenes are populated with nonprofessional actors, their dialogue overlapping, the blocking evolving naturally, the immersion in each character’s world totally ethnographic. Gems takes place during the 2012 NBA playoffs, and the period details are managed with fastidiousness. The lone concession seems to come about halfway through, when LaKeith Stanfield’s character pulls his SUV up to a curb, playing “Type of Way” at a deafening volume. While that song wouldn’t come out until the year after the Celtics’ run, the filmmakers evidently felt that fracturing their reality was worth it for its punishing effect. This, in so many ways, sums up Quan’s career: unstuck in time ever so slightly, caught between eras, yet still, on the most fundamental level, undeniable.
Paul Thompson is the senior editor of the Los Angeles Review of Books. His work has appeared in Rolling Stone, New York magazine, and GQ.
Editor’s note, September 5, 2024: This piece was originally published on July 30, 2019, when the fourth episode of Break Stuff: The Story of Woodstock ’99 first released. To mark the recent 25th anniversary of the festival, The Ringer is resurfacing Break Stuff on its own dedicated Spotify feed.
In 1999, a music festival in upstate New York became a social experiment. There were riots, looting, and numerous assaults, all set to a soundtrack of the era’s most aggressive rock bands. Incredibly, this was the third iteration of Woodstock, a festival originally known for peace, love, and hippie idealism. But Woodstock ’99 revealed some hard truths behind the myths of the 1960s and the danger that nostalgia can engender.
Break Stuff, an eight-part documentary podcast series now available on Spotify, investigates what went wrong at Woodstock ’99 and the legacy of the event as host Steven Hyden interviews promoters, attendees, journalists, and musicians. We’ve already explored whether Limp Bizkit were to blame for the chaos, how the story of the original Woodstock is mostly a myth, and how the host town prepared for the festival. In Episode 4, Hyden looks at how the first night of Woodstock ’99 set the stage for what was to come.
As attendees filed into Griffiss Air Force Base for the first day of the festival, large crowds swelled around the east and west stages. And when I say large, I mean humongous. It’s estimated that 220,000 people attended the festival, plus an additional 10,000 who worked there.
“It was kind of an out-of-body experience when you play a big festival like that, you know, where you can’t see the end of the crowd,” said Noodles, a guitarist for the Offspring.
In 1994, Noodles’s band released Smash,a blockbuster that sold 11 million copies, making it the best-selling record ever to be put out by an independent label. Five years later, the Offspring were still big MTV stars. But even a band as popular as the Offspring was humbled by the size of Woodstock ’99.
“We flew over it on our way in,” he says. “The area that this festival took over was really just a huge, huge area. We’ve been able to fly over other festivals since and it’s one of the biggest for sure. So it looked kind of cool, we were really excited.”
Once the band touched down and arrived backstage, however, the grandeur of Woodstock ‘99 also came crashing down.
“The venue really wasn’t great,” he says. “You know, it wasn’t a very hospitable. So it was kind of bleak in that regard.”
The Offspring were scheduled to play after the rapper DMX and before Korn. On stage, the members of the band stared into a vast sea of humanity that stretched as far as the eye could see. Playing Woodstock ’99 was a pretty heady experience for a band that came up in the underground punk scene.
“It is a little overwhelming,” Noodles says. “We’ve done it so much now that I guess I get more and more used to it, but still there’s an energy there that’s unlike anything else, and I guess that was kind of fun. It was, I think, a little too much, just a little bit too big.”
Most musicians will say the most disorienting aspect of performing at an event as massive as Woodstock ’99 is the disconnection from the audience. Even in an arena, an artist can still see the people in the first few rows. But at Woodstock ’99, the distance between performer and fan was nearly insurmountable.
“You know, the audience was super far away, there were big cameras on tracks that were in between us and the crowd as well,” Noodles says. “So just kind of connecting with the audience was a little bit more difficult.”
But the band didn’t miss everything. There was one moment when Offspring singer Dexter Holland was able to discern some bad behavior in the audience. It occurred near the end of the band’s set, when Holland decided to comment on it.
“But you know what, I was noticing something, I gotta call your attention to it for just a second,” Holland said on stage. “I’ve been noticing that there’s a lot of girls coming over the top here crowdsurfing. And they’re getting really groped, you know what I mean. Now I think, just because a girl wants to go crowdsurfing or whatever, that doesn’t give a guy the right to molest ’em, know what I’m sayin’?”
Then, Holland said that the audience members should take matters into their own hands.
“If you’re a guy and you see a girl go overhead, give her a break,” he said. “If you’re a girl and you see a guy go overhead, I want you to grab his fucking balls!”
But again, in the moment, the bands were in a totally different world from the audience. And that surely affects the perspective of artists like Jonathan Davis, the lead singer of Korn. When he talks about Woodstock ’99, he doesn’t think about sexual assaults.
It was the biggest fucking group of people I ever saw in a festival setting like that in America, and all I know is our show was amazing,” Davis says.
Woodstock ’99 was the first concert that Korn had played in months. The band had been holed up in Los Angeles working on a new album. After so much hard work, playing a big concert in front of hundreds of thousands of people was a much-needed release.
“It was us, Limp Bizkit, Ice Cube, all these people,” he says. “We all chartered a big 737, and we all flew from L.A. to the site, and it was just amazing. We had a huge party on that plane, we were all just listening to music and having fun. We were playing craps and it was just amazing—an amazing experience.”
When you watch Korn’s performance on YouTube, you can see both what went right and what went wrong. On one hand, the band played incredibly—any signs of rust from not touring were obliterated by the nuclear-level energy coming off the crowd. On the other hand, you can see a female crowd surfer fighting off dozens of men attempting to grope her.
The separation between Korn and the audience is obvious. I wonder whether it was also apparent in the moment—I wasn’t there, but I suspect that the audience felt like it was in its own world. That feeling helps to embolden bad behavior. In the end, nobody seems to take responsibility for when things go sideways.
As for Jonathan Davis, it’s obvious that his adrenaline was jacked through the roof. He will never forget what it felt like to perform that night.
“I mean, it’s like no drug on earth,” Davis says. “For me, at least for Korn, when we play, I have a real intense connection with the crowd. I’ve never been a frontman that talks a lot but I think by the way that I perform and how emotions come across, that I touch something that makes people want to do that thing.”
He still remembers how the crowd reacted to the last song of the night.
“When we were doing ‘My Gift to You,’ and I had a lighter and I got everybody to put their lighters up in the air or when they were you know all jumping or just pumping their fist,” Davis says. “Those moments were really huge moments to have that many people doing it.”
Jonathan Davis of Korn during Woodstock ’99WireImage
For Davis, the only negativity associated with Woodstock ’99 happened backstage.
It was a feud with a band playing that night on the west stage, commonly regarded as festival’s B-list showcase.
“Insane Clown Posse wanted to fight us or some stupid bullshit that I don’t understand,” Davis says. “But Cube’s people put them in their place and that was it. That was the only drama.”
To this day, Davis is confused as to why Insane Clown Posse had a beef with Korn.
“I don’t even fucking know why they don’t like us,” he says. “I heard that they talked some other shit about us before too. I think they like to start shit just to get press or start a beef and get things going. I don’t know––I was a huge fan of ICP and that whole Juggalo thing. I think it’s cool.”
Here’s something you should know about me: I love band rivalries. I even wrote a book about it. And yet, in all of my research about Woodstock ’99, I hadn’t come across any information about a fight between Korn and Insane Clown Posse. I didn’t know about it until Jonathan Davis brought it up, unprompted.
Naturally, I now wanted to insert myself into some Korn vs. ICP drama. So I reached out to Violent J, who makes up Insane Clown Posse with fellow rapper Shaggy 2 Dope. And I asked him, “Hey, Violent J, why were you so mad at Korn back in 1999?”
According to Violent J, ICP didn’t have beef with Korn at all. In fact, the opposite was true. ICP worshipped Korn.
“What happened was, we kind of diss them in the lyric,” he says. “You know what I mean.”
In case you don’t know what he means: The diss lyric occurs in the song “Everybody Rize,” which mocks Jonathan Davis for a song he wrote about being bullied as a kid.
“It was uncalled for and it was stupid,” he says. “When we dissed them, it was an old lyric. So when we saw them we apologized for that and they had no idea what we were talking about.”
In my experience, Violent J isn’t really an accurate moniker. He was more like Gregarious J. I don’t think I talked to anyone who was happier to talk about Woodstock ’99. He was like a little kid talking about meeting Santa Claus for the first time.
“They drove us to the other stage,” Violent J says. “We hadn’t looked out, and we didn’t see the crowd or anything. And we came out and boom! It was just packed, and we were so happy. We couldn’t believe it. We were so excited, because it wasn’t like the other festivals we’d done. There was a lot of people there that would want to see us, you know, and that felt so good. It felt so cool to be a part of something.”
Insane Clown Posse formed in Detroit in 1989. From the beginning, they were outcasts—too rap for the rock crowd, and too rock for the rap crowd. Both sides seemed to agree that ICP were ridiculous. But Woodstock ’99 signified a rare moment of acceptance. Violent J finally felt like a true rock star.
“We always call ourselves the most hated band in the world,” he says. “And we’ve always played up the role that we like being the outcasts, you know? But in reality there’s always been an urge to want to be accepted to something. I mean, we want to be considered cool enough to be there.Andthat was like the ultimate reward. That that was something that really came through for us and felt that way.”
The band decided to show their appreciation by giving back to the audience at the concert.
“Yo, I know for Woodstock, tickets were a little expensive,” he said from on stage. “And me and Shaggy, we got paid a lot of money to be here. So we decided to give you all your money back.”
Then the band kicked a basket of red and yellow dodgeballs into the audience—each one with a $100 bill taped to it. And once those balls were gone, ICP kicked balls with $500 attached to them.
“We wanted to try to come up with some extra flavor for Woodstock,” he says now. “They were all jumping up trying to grab them, and that would just make the ball fly in the air again.”
Along with the free money, there was also some boorishness during ICP’s set. At one point, Violent J and Shaggy 2 Dope invited women to shed their tops onstage. Then they doused the women with Faygo soda.
When you watch the video, it all seems playful. The women appear to be doing this of their own volition, and having a good time. But in the harsh light of 2019, the whole thing seems pretty gross. It’s the sort of mindless decadence you associate with the fall of great empires.
The darkest impulses of Woodstock ’99 were already manifesting on Friday—two full days before tensions finally boiled over in the form of riots and looting.
Hosts: Van Lathan, Charles Holmes, and Jomi Adeniran Producers: Aleya Zenieris, Jonathan Kermah, and Steve Ahlman Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopal
Sean and Amanda recap the long weekend in film news and discuss the biggest films out of the Telluride Film Festival, including the much-anticipated Anora, the SNL origin story Saturday Night, the Trump biopic The Apprentice, and more (1:00). Then, they react to the Venice Film Festival from afar and take stock of the impact that this weekend’s major festivals have had on the state of the awards race (58:00). Finally, they share the yet-to-be-released movies that they’re most excited for this fall (1:20:00).
Hosts: Sean Fennessey and Amanda Dobbins Senior Producer: Bobby Wagner
This Labor Day, Van and Rachel are bringing you a brand-new segment called the Van LaTEN! This time, they count down the top 10 Black beauties of the ’90s.
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