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  • The Nostalgic Glow of the Movie Soundtrack

    The Nostalgic Glow of the Movie Soundtrack

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    I Saw the TV Glow is, on its surface, a movie about identity and teenage isolation. But it’s also about how we attach those ideas to art and entertainment consumption during our formative years. And on yet another level, A24’s new psychological coming-of-age drama is about the mediums through which art and entertainment are passed down. Largely set in the ’90s, the movie revolves around two teens, Owen and Maddy, who bond over a surreal YA television show called The Pink Opaque. (Think: Buffy meets A Trip to the Moon.) But Owen’s parents forbid him from watching—“Isn’t that a show for girls?” asks Owen’s dad, played by Fred Durst—so he can only consume the series in secretive ways. Specifically: VHS dubs of The Pink Opaque that Maddy makes for Owen and hides in the high school dark room. It’s a relic from the pre-streaming era that should feel familiar to older millennials—the idea that a piece of physical media could change your life.

    It’s fitting, then, that A24 and director Jane Schoenbrun have staked a large part of the movie’s experience on another relic of the pre-streaming era: the compilation soundtrack. The I Saw the TV Glow OST is the type of project you don’t see much of in 2024. It’s a who’s who of indie music mixed with a handful of rising artists, all providing original recordings. The album, which was released on May 10 through A24 Music, features stars such as Phoebe Bridgers and Caroline Polachek alongside critical darlings Bartees Strange and L’Rain, plus exciting (relative) newcomers such as Sadurn and King Woman. On its own, it may be one of the best collections of songs you’ll hear all year. But tied to Schoenbrun’s tale of identity repression and awakening, the tracks take on vivid life. (Certain songs are inextricable from specific scenes—like Polachek’s “Starburned and Unkissed” playing as handwritten notes cover the screen, or Maria BC’s haunting “Taper” playing during Maddy’s set-piece monologue.)

    For Schoenbrun, this marriage of sight and sound was always the vision for I Saw the TV Glow, which releases wide on Friday. The hope was to make something similar to the soundtracks for Donnie Darko, The Doom Generation, and John Hughes’s most famous movies—all indelible, and all inspirations Schoenbrun cites. (This was in addition to commissioning a gorgeous score by Alex G, who also worked on Schoenbrun’s last film, 2021’s We’re All Going to the World’s Fair.) The director—a self-described music nerd who grew up escaping to punk shows in New York City—even went as far as to make individualized playlists for artists to give them a sense of Schoenbrun’s thinking. “I knew that there was a sort of ground level of sad girl lesbian shit that I love and felt in line with the film, but I didn’t want it to just be that,” Schoenbrun says. “A great soundtrack needs to explore outwards, in the way that the Drab Majesty song does or the Proper song does. If it was just one thing 16 times, people would get bored really quickly. But if it was 16 things that all feel a piece of themselves, it could stand the test of time.”

    That approach pays off throughout the film, like during King Woman’s visceral in-movie performance of “Psychic Wound” (a moment that will make any self-respecting Twin Peaks fan recall the Roadhouse performances) or yeule’s cover of Broken Social Scene’s “Anthems for a Seventeen Year-Old Girl,” which appears twice in I Saw the TV Glow. (It’s perhaps fitting that BSS’s 2002 original had another soundtrack moment in 2010, when it was featured in Scott Pilgrim Vs. the World.) Ultimately, despite the “various artists” label, the I Saw the TV Glow soundtrack feels like a cohesive document—a testament to not only how the movie ties the songs together, but also the work that Schoenbrun, A24, and music supervisors Chris Swanson and Jessica Berndt put into it.

    “I didn’t want it to be the dumb soundtrack of pop-rock cover songs of ’70s hits or whatever,” Schoenbrun says. “I didn’t want it to become pastiche or an exercise for anybody, but I think I knew I was playing within this lineage of the Mallrats soundtrack or the Buffy original soundtrack. I wanted to create this thing that could conjure that memory. Because so much of what the film is trying to do is conjure that era of media.”

    Much like the plot of the movie, the existence of this soundtrack seems both sentimental and unfamiliar. (Or, as Taja Cheek—who records under the name L’Rain and contributed the song “Green” to the project—tells me, “very nostalgic, but also really kind of fresh and new.”) While these types of compilation albums used to be the norm, the movie and music industries have shied away from them in the new economic and streaming realities. And in some cases, that’s maybe not a bad thing—the fewer blockbuster soundtracks, the fewer Godzilla-style abominations we have to deal with. But that also means fewer—if any—Doom Generations or Above the Rims or Empire Records. And that maybe means a world where original music doesn’t matter as much to a movie unless it’s a score by one of the few dozen composers who get regular work.

    So the question becomes: If I Saw the TV Glow and its accompanying album succeed, do they have the potential to become almost a real-life extension of the Maddy-Owen VHS experience? Meaning: Could they pass down the soundtrack experience, making it easier for other filmmakers and studios to take similar risks? Because in this case, the medium is as fascinating as what it contains—and how it connects to the past.

    A24

    For Swanson, one of the TV Glow music supervisors and the cofounder of indie music powerhouse Secretly Group, it was Pump Up the Volume. (“Pump Up the Volume actually made me want to start my own pirate radio station,” he says. “I was convinced that was my destiny.”) For Billboard writer Andrew Unterberger, it was not only beloved albums like the Singles and Kids OSTs, but also strange artifacts like the one for The Cable Guy. (“A couple hits from it, but do I actually remember any of those being in that movie? Maybe one, maybe two.”) For L’Rain—one of the stars of the I Saw the TV Glow album—it was Whitney Houston’s Waiting to Exhale. (“Just like, ‘Wow, look at all of these very famous women that are contributing to the soundtrack.’”) For veteran music supervisor Liz Gallacher, it was one of the forever classics: Pretty in Pink and all the Smiths and Echo & the Bunnymen that entailed. (“My absolute hero is John Hughes,” she says. “The way that he used music, it just spoke to me so much when I was younger.”)

    Everyone interviewed for this pointed to a soundtrack or two that they’ve fallen in love with. Many were filled with original songs. Some, like the Wes Anderson soundtracks that longtime music supervisor Zach Cowie highlighted, became beloved for introducing new generations to long-overlooked songs. (Personally speaking, I can trace my Nico and Velvet Underground love back to this scene.) But the soundtracks that everyone cited share a common thread: They are all, by this point, decades old.

    It’s tempting to dismiss that as a function of age—most people I spoke with grew up in the ’80s or ’90s, after all. But digging into data unearths an unavoidable reality: There are far fewer movie soundtrack albums that break through these days, and the ones that do often bear little resemblance to the ones that held cultural real estate throughout the ’80s, ’90s, and early 2000s.

    The Ringer examined Billboard’s year-end top 100 albums list for every year going back to 1978, the year that Saturday Night Fever and Grease finished no. 1 and no. 2, respectively (the Apex Mountain for John Travolta and Italian Americans dancing on-screen). That year, four movie soundtrack albums placed in the list: those two, plus the one for the musical-comedy Thank God It’s Friday and the movie FM, which featured Steely Dan’s eponymous hit. For the next decade-plus, the number stayed roughly in that ballpark besides a few fallow periods (just one soundtrack album placed in the top 100 in 1983: Flashdance) and sporadic spikes (seven made it the following year, including Flashdance again, but also Purple Rain, Footloose, and, naturally, The Big Chill). But the numbers take off starting in the mid-1990s: 10 make the list in 1994, nine in 1995, 12 in 1997, and a whopping 13 in 1998. (Possibly 14, depending on how you classify Spiceworld.)

    If you grew up in the era, you’re undoubtedly familiar with how seemingly every movie had an accompanying “soundtrack”—typically a mix of songs that would appear in the movie alongside others totally unrelated to it, which were included under the loose “inspired by the motion picture” banner. Track lists were often filled with loosies from marquee artists and whatever new artist the label was looking to promote. Some were overfilled behemoths that doubled as a testament to record industry gluttony—everyone remembers Batman Forever for Seal’s no. 1 hit “Kiss From a Rose,” but what about U2, Method Man, and Sunny Day Real Estate?—while others became beloved documents of a sound or era. (See: how Singles helped codify the sound of grunge and Above the Rim solidified Death Row’s place in the industry and gave us “Regulate” in the process.) Sometimes, the soundtrack’s notoriety far eclipsed the movie it was allegedly inspired by. (It’s long been a joke around these parts that no one has actually seen the movie Judgment Night despite the notoriety of its rap-rock mashups, but the same could be said of High School High and The Show and their influential hip-hop soundtracks.)

    Where so many of the popular soundtracks of the ’70s and ’80s came from movies explicitly about music—Purple Rain, Footloose, Saturday Night Fever—these ’90s OSTs were often different. Slightly craven—but in some ways, no less essential. How else do you explain something like the album that accompanied Bulworth? “There weren’t movies about music or about characters that were particularly interested in music,” says Unterberger, the Billboard journalist. “Or there weren’t musical situations necessarily in the movie, but they still had to have these sorts of big-ticket soundtracks. … They weren’t always the most artistically lofty collections of music, but they were a lot of fun.”

    It was good business for the labels in the era when you could charge $17.99 for a CD and not have to worry about much beyond a hit song or two. (Also, for the movie studios, they doubled as good promotion: What better way to promote Batman Forever than to have clips of Jim Carrey’s Riddler pop up between shirtless shots of Seal every hour on MTV?) But these albums also provided something for the listener: a way to deepen their connection with the film. Gallacher—a music supervisor who has worked on movies such as The Full Monty, 24 Hour Party People, and Bend It Like Beckham—says that, at their best, these kinds of soundtracks were an extension of the filmgoing experience that could be popped into a Walkman or six-CD changer for months or years afterward. “There was an element back in the day of people wanting a sort of souvenir of the movie,” she says. “You could put things together like compilation albums in a way, and people felt like that was a souvenir of the movie.”

    Of course, like many things in the music industry, the bottom fell out of the movie soundtrack market over the next decade. As downloads—first illegal and then through iTunes and other digital marketplaces—began to erode the idea of the album, these types of compilations began to fade. In 1999, the year Napster debuted, nine soundtracks finished in Billboard’s year-end top 100. The years immediately after hovered between three and five albums. And even when the numbers have reached similar heights as the ’90s—like in 2008, when eight movie soundtracks made the year-end list—those figures were buoyed by albums aimed at decidedly younger audiences. (In other words, lots of High School Musical and Cheetah Girls.) In more recent years, as streaming has replaced downloads and plays have become the primary means of measuring an album’s success, kids’ movies have often been the only reliable chart producers. (Moana, for example, made the year-end top 100 each year from 2017 to 2021. And in 2021, it was the only soundtrack to earn that distinction.) Twenty years after Garden State, the idea that something like its accompanying album could break through seems far-fetched. If a song will change your life, odds are it’s not coming from a soundtrack.

    I was struck by the streaming aspect recently when I got out of a screening of Bertrand Bonello’s The Beast, a time-warping love story that uses the music of Roy Orbison, Visage, and Frankie Valli to staggering effect. Its soundtrack is a different concern from I Saw the TV Glow’s—where TV Glow uses only brand-new recordings, The Beast recontextualizes older songs, not unlike a Wes Anderson or Quentin Tarantino movie. Shortly after the QR code credits rolled, several of the tracks were still rattling around in my brain. Twenty years ago, I may have driven straight from the theater to the store to buy The Beast’s soundtrack. Instead, before I had even started my engine, I found a playlist of the songs in the movie—one put together not by the studio or a record label, but by a user named “filmlinc”—and gave it a like. (And here seems like as good of a place as any to note that Spotify is The Ringer’s parent company.)

    The process isn’t exactly novel—this is what music consumption is for most people in 2024. But given the difficulty and expense that comes with acquiring the rights for these songs—especially at a time when old music is more in demand than new music—these kinds of compilation soundtracks functionally don’t exist as a commercial or physical product. (The Beast’s does exist in a truncated form, with Bonello’s original score packaged alongside a few of the synced tracks.) For Zach Cowie, a music supervisor who’s worked on Master of None and American Fiction, that intangibility has made these kinds of compilations feel fleeting and disposable. “We all know what the cover of the Forrest Gump soundtrack looks like,” Cowie says. “Because somebody you knew had it if you didn’t have it. Having them be physical objects I think is what established this moment that we’re talking about.”

    Even for Gallacher, who’s seen soundtracks she’s worked on receive gold plaques or achieve cult status, it’s an evolution that makes sense. “No one wants a compilation anymore of music from a movie,” Gallacher says. “They can just go and listen to their favorite songs anytime on Spotify. They don’t need that. People will put playlists on.”

    It’s fair to say that few shed tears over the death of the Forrest Gump–style soundtrack—which charged consumers upwards of $30 for the privilege of hearing Joan Baez and Creedence back-to-back. The overall decline in the market has, however, had a knock-on effect on compilation soundtracks filled with original music—like ones from Singles or I Saw the TV Glow. Looking at the Billboard charts reveals how rare of a commodity they’ve become. Besides kids’ flicks, the types of OSTs that have tended to make the year-end top 100 recently either are tied to music-centric films (La La Land, A Star Is Born) or have been helmed by a headlining superstar musician. (But even those are rare: Kendrick Lamar’s platinum-certified Black Panther soundtrack was certainly the exception, not the rule.)

    Ones for smaller movies are practically nonexistent—and even when they do exist, they gain less traction. Unterberger recalls a soundtrack to the film The Turning, which came out in January 2020. The movie and its music came and went with barely anyone noticing. This happened even though the soundtrack possessed an ethos similar to I Saw the TV Glow’s—The Turning’s album boasted the likes of Mitski, Empress Of, and a living legend (and friend of The Ringer) in Courtney Love. From Unterberger’s vantage point, however, The Turning lacked one thing that TV Glow has: a sense of intentionality with the music. “It was actually one of my favorite albums of that year, and it felt coherent as a soundtrack,” Unterberger says of The Turning. “But it seemed to have very little to do with the movie—it didn’t seem to really feed off of the movie in any way that I could tell just by listening to it. And it didn’t really get a lot of attention.”

    To that end, I Saw the TV Glow has something in common with the biggest non-franchise movie of the past few years: Barbie. (The truly opaque pink.) While the two movies couldn’t feel more different in terms of scale and subject—other than some of Barbie’s broad-strokes platitudes about identity and gender—Greta Gerwig’s movie also made the music feel integral. Helmed by a trio of producers including Mark Ronson, Barbie the Album recruited some of the biggest stars to make music specifically for the film, and many of those songs became the backbone of some of the film’s biggest moments. (“I’m Just Ken,” anyone?) The album spawned two top-10 singles—Dua Lipa’s “Dance the Night” and Nicki Minaj and Ice Spice’s “Barbie World”—and won Billie Eilish and Finneas a few pieces of hardware to go along with the Mattel plastic.

    Cowie credits the creators of Barbie for not only enlisting the artists they did, but also making the songs feel organic in the universe of the film. The audience, he says, can typically tell when the approach is thoughtful. And that counts for something in a music-discovery landscape increasingly dominated by the algorithm and hivemind curation. “It was the best possible thing to support the world that they were building,” Cowie says of Barbie. “And people paid attention to that. But what made that happen is the fact that everyone in the world saw that movie. If the music was an afterthought, no one would talk about the music.”

    Barring a (welcome) miracle, I Saw the TV Glow likely won’t be the type of movie that everyone in the world goes to see. But it is one that’s sure to develop a dedicated following—the Donnie Darko and Twin Peaks comparisons go deeper than the musical moments. And that’s part of the reason Schoenbrun took the “mixtape approach” to this soundtrack. They wanted to create moments and heighten story beats, but they also wanted to produce something that felt “made lovingly”—“distinctive from a Spotify playlist or a YouTube recommendation.” (Or, put another way: They wanted something that felt like the result of “angry sex between capitalism and art-making.”)

    “There’s something very human about it, and there’s something that’s not disposable,” Schoenbrun says. “There’s something that feels lovingly prepared. The handmade nature of it—the physicality of it, even if it’s not literally physical—is a big part of the appeal.”

    A24

    Schoenbrun, of course, had the vision for what they wanted the I Saw the TV Glow soundtrack to be. It also helped that they had a willing partner in their studio to make it happen.

    There’s no shortage of praise being heaped upon A24, which has grown in the past decade from a scrappy, small indie to one of the most recognizable names in film on the back of its creatives-first mindset. But it’s worth calling out its approach to music as a microcosm of that. Arguably no movie company has put such a focus on sonic backdrops in recent years as the one responsible for Uncut Gems and its Daniel Lopatin score and the 4K restoration of the Talking Heads’ classic concert film, Stop Making Sense. (Speaking of, you can preorder the SMS tribute album featuring Paramore and Lorde, among others, right now.) The company has even gone as far as to form its own label, A24 Music (which, like its embrace of T-shirt maker Online Ceramics, can be seen as good business and great branding as much as it is a means of producing art).

    Schoenbrun says that many of their early conversations with the studio revolved around the idea of making an all-original compilation that both worked inside of the movie and also stood on its own outside of it. They’re not confident that would’ve been possible at a studio that either (1) didn’t have the same track record of prestige and success as A24 or (2) was inherently more risk averse because of the costs associated with these types of projects. “A lot of other studios operating at the level of A24 or above the level of A24, financially, just don’t have any room to take a shot on something coming from a place of love, rather than a place of like, ‘Well, if we have these 16 artists on the soundtrack, our data tells us that it’s going to get this many streams on Spotify and make us this much money in sales or whatever,’” Schoenbrun says. “And I think A24 has made its name and staked its brand on finding people like me, who have a lot of love and want to make something with that love, and I think that is a process that is inherently at odds with the other thing.”

    A24 representatives declined to comment for this article, but others—both ones who have worked with the company and ones who haven’t—were complimentary of the way it tackles music and how it fits into the overall mission. “I love A24 because that’s the kind of studio that would allow something like that to happen,” Cowie says. “I just love their artist-first thing. I don’t think you’d be able to do this at another studio.”

    For Swanson, who co-supervised the music on I Saw the TV Glow, what made the music feel important was the simple fact that Schoenbrun and A24 treated it as though it was. On other projects with other studios, the soundtrack often comes last, as counterintuitive as it may seem. That never felt like the case here, Swanson says. “They embed their music department in with the creative force, the producers, and director of the films early enough that they’re employing their credibility, their budget,” he says. “It’s not uncommon for music supervisors to be relegated to a postproduction role after most of the money’s been spent. The filmmaker isn’t less aspirational about music. It’s just by virtue of it being dealt with last, you’ve got to find the change in the couch cushions. That these combos are starting so early is a game changer.”

    All of this made I Saw the TV Glow a unique project for Swanson and Berndt, who co-supervised the music with him. Supervising work typically involves making playlists and sourcing songs, Berndt says. This time, it was collaborating closely with Schoenbrun. “We’ve certainly taken early meetings on projects not too far from this where they want to do a bunch of original songs,” Berndt says. “They want to create real soundtrack moments with some commissioned songs. And it’s pretty rare that it can actually happen. Obviously, it takes budget, time, creativity, the right timeline for artists to be able to have the capacity to create music like this for a film. And we just got really lucky that we could actually make it happen.”

    And that work shows up on the screen. Berndt and Swanson both point to the two on-screen performances—one by Sloppy Jane and Phoebe Bridgers, another by King Woman. Where live performances in movies can often come across as forced, these feel organic. And more importantly, they also help push the narrative forward. “It’s like, at this point, everything is going to shift for Owen,” Berndt says. “It’s like this moment of, ‘Oh, Maddy’s back, this is great.’ It’s like, ‘Where have you been? Tell me everything.’ And then your whole world is changing with what Maddy is telling Owen. And just that beautiful moment of these wonderful performances happening both in the forefront and then in the background of their heavy conversation is just the most beautiful moment in shifting the way the rest of the film is going to go.”

    It’s scenes like that that have the potential to make the I Saw the TV Glow soundtrack resonate like so many of the projects from decades ago. The album likely won’t reach Saturday Night Fever heights—though, admittedly, it was never designed to—but it’s not hard to imagine it could become an object of cultish devotion, like a Donnie Darko or Gregg Araki soundtrack. And if this record does catch on, it’s possible we’ll see a world where studios take more shots like this. We may not be looking at a full-on resurgence of compilation soundtracks, but projects like TV Glow and Barbie show that with the proper care and creativity, there’s still a market for them. “It’s getting attention—the music for it—before the movie’s even happened,” says Cowie. “Anything that draws attention to this age-old thing still having some power is so great. … What would be so rad is if this does come out and it continues to have the reception it has before it’s even out. That opens the doors wider at all the other studios because it’s proof that this can still work.”

    That would be a happy accident for Schoenbrun. Ultimately, their hopes are that the soundtrack and the movie each become portals into different worlds: the movie as a means of discovering artists such as L’Rain and Maria BC, the music as a means of leading people to seek out the on-screen lives of Owen and Maddy. And if more people discover a nostalgic medium in the process, all the better.

    “I’m really hoping that, when people watch the movie and discover the music—or vice versa, listen to the soundtrack and then go discover the movie—that this level of handmade care and sharing something, it comes through.”

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    Justin Sayles

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  • Why Conor Oberst Learned the Conor Oberst Songbook All Over Again

    Why Conor Oberst Learned the Conor Oberst Songbook All Over Again

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    On Thursday, Conor Oberst will complete his latest attempt to shake up the routines that develop when you’ve been making music for over 30 years. Every week throughout March and April, the prolific, Omaha-born songwriter assembled a new band, spent four days rehearsing with them, and then performed a distinct, career-spanning show with a set list filled with his lesser-known songs. Billed as “Conor Oberst and Friends,” the run was split into two locations: The first four installments happened at the Teragram Ballroom in Los Angeles, while the following New York appearances took place at the Bowery Ballroom.

    Oberst estimates he’s written about 500 songs in his lifetime, and at these eight shows, he’s played over 100 of them, plus a smattering of covers by the likes of the Replacements and Daniel Johnston. He’s had to relearn tracks he’s released both under his own name and as Bright Eyes, his pseudonymous solo endeavor that developed into a group with Mike Mogis and Nate Walcott. Some of his albums got more love than others (lots of I’m Wide Awake, It’s Morning and his self-titled, full-length album from 2008; not so much Cassadaga or anything from Desaparecidos, unfortunately). Each assembled band had its own musical director and its own flavor, from the turn-of-the-millennium New York cool of Nick Zinner of Yeah Yeah Yeahs, to the rootsy approach of James Felice of the Felice Brothers, to the ramshackle, early Saddle Creek vibes of Maria Taylor of Azure Ray—all of which correlate to a sonic element of Oberst’s music.

    Oberst has been a key influence on younger artists including Hurray for the Riff Raff, Waxahatchee, and Phoebe Bridgers, his Better Oblivion Community Center partner who joined him for three songs at the third Los Angeles date. In turn, those artists’ fans have started discovering Oberst’s music, and these residencies were their first chance to see him attempt some of these rarer songs live.

    Just before the last Conor Oberst and Friends show, The Ringer spoke to him about how the whole thing came together and how he feels now that it’s almost done. This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.

    Why did you decide to do this now?

    This guy Eric [Dimenstein], who’s been my booking agent for like 20 years, we’ve on and off talked about the idea, but the timing was never right. There’s always a record or something else to do. So, yeah, it kind of worked out timing-wise. And New York and L.A. are the most obvious spots, but they’re also two places where I have lived in my life and have a lot of friends, so there’s a lot of musicians and people to draw from, as far as the bands.

    Why did this idea intrigue you in the first place?

    It was honestly just trying something new. Sometimes when you go on tour, it’s great and you get really close with the people you’re with, but after a while, it becomes routine, unfortunately. I’m not really in a jam band, so you end up doing similar sets. You might change a couple songs a night, but for the most part, once you get the show up and running, that’s the show and that’s what you present in every town you go to. It seemed fun to just change that dynamic, where it’s just once a week, but every week I don’t really know what’s going to happen. That’s exciting because I’ve been doing this a long time. And then it’s just a chance to revisit a lot of past material and random songs I haven’t played in a long time.

    Each week, one of the people in the band acted as the musical director and helped pick the songs and organize the band. Even with Bright Eyes, besides Mike and Nate, we always had different people on tour with us, so I’m used to playing with a lot of different people, but I’m not used to doing it so consecutively and quickly. It’s the closest I feel like I’ve had to a real job for a long time. Because it’s rehearse Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, play the show Thursday, and then Friday and Saturday are my days off. But even those days, I have to try and listen to the next week’s songs and remember stuff.

    Are the bands practicing together beforehand without you, or is it really that week when you all start playing together for the first time?

    Maybe some of them were practicing on their own, but no, not really. Another thing was, I didn’t want any songs to repeat in New York or L.A. The ones we played in L.A., we could play in New York, but that was the rule: For the city, don’t repeat any songs. That’s a lot of songs. Once I figured out who was going to be the band leader for all the weeks, we had to get square with the set list because some people wanted to do the same song.

    Some negotiating had to happen.

    Yeah, exactly. But I’m a natural-born diplomat, so it’s fine.

    Were there songs that they would pitch that you were particularly excited about revisiting?

    Nick Zinner from Yeah Yeah Yeahs was last week. We made the Digital Ash [in a Digital Urn] record, and he was in the band for that tour. So I knew we were going to do a bunch of those songs, or I assumed that would be the case. He picked this song “True Blue,” which I wrote for my nephew when he was, like, 4 years old. It’s just the weirdest song for Nick to pick. He’s like a vampire, so I just think he’s going to pick the darkest ones, but he picked this. It just made me laugh. I was like, “You really want to do that one?” So there was stuff like that along the way that was surprising.

    Were there songs that you had never played live that came up?

    I don’t know about that, but there’s definitely ones where it had been years [since I had revisited them]. There were some covers that were brand new to me. I’m pretty sure I played all the songs of mine at some point in my life, but like I said, I’ve been doing this a long time, and I don’t have the greatest memory.

    Were there any songs where you were like, “I’m not doing that one?”

    I really shied away from the ones that I’ve played so much, like “First Day of My Life” and “Lua.” Those didn’t feel as exciting. I guess we did play “First Day” on Maria’s week. [Editor’s note: He also played “Lua” that night as a duet with Phoebe Bridgers.] I was definitely leaning a little bit away from the ones that we’ve done in the last couple years.

    Some of these songs are over 20 years old. When you revisit a song like that, do you still relate to the person who wrote it?

    To be honest, sometimes not really at all. But I do have memories connected with them. There’s this song that we’ve actually played quite a bit over the years called “Falling Out of Love at This Volume,” which is on the very first Bright Eyes record, and I was literally 15 years old when I wrote it. So yeah, I’m not at all the same person, but I do connect it with the memories of that time in my life. It’s not like doing a cover song. There’s an aspect of it I can relate to, but it’s a very distant memory. What I was feeling when I wrote it or whatever, that’s long gone.

    I’ve been a journalist for a while, and sometimes I’ll read articles I wrote when I was just starting, and I’m like, “What was that guy thinking?” And sometimes I’m like, “Oh yeah, that’s pretty smart, kid. Good job.”

    Right. This is actually weirdly connected to this whole thing in a way, which is Bright Eyes did this whole set of EPs that were companion pieces for all the records. I don’t know why I put myself through these fucking challenges, but we rerecorded a bunch of our old songs in new ways. I was very particular about which ones I wanted to sing, and they were the ones obviously that I still felt held up and that I felt some connection to, emotionally or mentally. You want that to be there or else it can feel like you’re just doing karaoke or something.

    Why do you put yourself through these complicated challenges?

    It’s like when people get older and they want to stave off early-onset dementia so they do a lot of crossword puzzles or something. I do shit like this, try to keep what brain cells I have left active.

    Have the shows felt different between L.A. and New York?

    New York, this has been really a real trip down memory lane because I lived in the East Village. I paid rent in New York for like 13 years, although I was on tour a lot of that time and in Omaha and stuff. I had probably five different apartments over the years, but they were all in the East Village. And now I got this apartment sublet thing for the month, so I’m really deep in. Obviously, some things have changed, but there’s ghosts everywhere. I can walk from the apartment to the practice space to the Bowery [Ballroom]. I don’t know if I’ve even gotten in a car here at all. It’s a trip because I have things I had forgotten about.

    I still live in L.A., and there we were just rehearsing at my house. So that was very comfortable and cool, but it was a little closer to my actual current life.

    As far as crowds and stuff, I don’t know, I don’t think they’re that different. All the crowds have been super gracious and nice and excited. We’ve made a point of not letting people know ahead of time what was up each week. Of course there are some diehards that are trying to go to every show, but a lot of people, they just pick the show and that’s what they got. I hope they had a good time though. I’m sure there’s some people that are like, “Aww, I wish I would’ve gone to that week.” But that’s the nature of the experiment.

    For these shows, are you reinterpreting songs in a different way than how you recorded them?

    Not really vastly reinterpreting, but we’ve extended a lot of parts. Like Miwi [La Lupa]’s week, we had a four-piece horn section, so there were parts that we extended to make room for that. Nick’s week, Lee Ranaldo [of Sonic Youth] was in the band, so you’ve got to make some time for him to solo and stuff. And then Nate Walcott’s week, which was the second week in L.A., was with Jeff Parker, the guitar player. It was all jazz musicians. I would say that week was the furthest from the way I would normally perform a song.

    How do you feel about playing live these days?

    You and me and everyone that follows music knows that it’s much harder to make a living off of record sales, so playing live is part of the job in that sense. I don’t have kids, but the guys in my band have kids and bills. It’s like, you got to keep making money. That’s the unromantic part about it, but there is truth to that. But I still like playing live. Honestly, I feel like when you’re on tour, you’re getting paid for all the bullshit you have to do, like check into the hotels and go to the airport and get on the bus and find food and do this and whatever. Actually being onstage performing music, for the most part, not always, that’s the best part of the day. Unless the show is total trash.

    Has this experience made you more or less excited to go on tour?

    It’s been so interesting and different, just because that stuff I’m talking about is gone. I don’t have to get on a bus or a plane or a hotel, but I have to rehearse all the time. The only thing I’ve been stressing on is just my voice holding up. People think, Well, it’s once a week; that should be easy. But the truth is, if you’re on tour, you’re singing maybe two hours a day. I’m singing eight hours a day for four days in a row [at rehearsals] and then doing the show. So I’ve been trying to be careful. I barely smoked cigarettes for these past couple months. I’m trying my best. Lots of tea, lots of Throat Coat, lots of Halls, whatever, all the tricks. From a physical standpoint, that’s the biggest difference. But on the other hand, you don’t have all the stress of travel. You’re in the same city and with your friends, so it’s great.

    Would you ever do this again?

    I don’t know. I guess it depends how long I live. Maybe it’ll sound fun in five years or something. One of our guitar techs and good friends, even when we’re having a shitty day, he’s like, “Beats sweeping the floor.” I’m like, “That’s true.” It has been a lot of work. I knew it was going to be a lot, but it’s been more than I thought it would be. I would have to be very rejuvenated to want to do this thing again.

    Eric Ducker is a writer and editor in Los Angeles.

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    Eric Ducker

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  • Moms in the ER

    Moms in the ER

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    Maybe the ancient ritual will help. Checked on her two hrs ago. Got worried and went back to check on her again since she went to the hospital friday. Now im waiting in the ER as the condition i found her in was much worse. Anybody got some cat memes i can disassociate with? Ill update later today.

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  • Drake, the Meat Messiah. Plus, Boaz Yakin on ‘Once Again (For the Very First Time).’

    Drake, the Meat Messiah. Plus, Boaz Yakin on ‘Once Again (For the Very First Time).’

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    Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay kick off the show with some Super Bowl, and unfortunately, Taylor Swift talk (3:05) before reacting to an alleged video leak of Drake (26:56). Then, they dig into Mo’Nique’s appearance on Club Shay Shay (39:59), before welcoming writer-director Boaz Yakin to discuss his upcoming film, executive-produced by Van, Once Again (For the Very First Time) (55:23),

    Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay
    Guest: Boaz Yakin
    Producers: Donnie Beacham Jr. and Ashleigh Smith

    Subscribe: Spotify / Apple Podcasts / Stitcher

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    Van Lathan

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  • I Regret To Inform You

    I Regret To Inform You

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    I just panicked and said yes to a brutal logging job that will probably make me want to kill myself again because they offered me lots of money and a truck. It’s been an honor **** posting with you 18 hours a day, I’ll be around, just less. *salutes*

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  • Doctor Who time traveled back to 2008 to save the show in 2023

    Doctor Who time traveled back to 2008 to save the show in 2023

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    The hero of BBC’s long-running sci-fi series Doctor Who is, famously, not a real medical doctor, but they have been a bit ill. What should have been a promising changing of the guard in 2018 — with new showrunner Chris Chibnall and the first woman cast as The Doctor since the series’ 1963 debut — only served to accelerate a gradual downward slide that began in the latter half of previous showrunner Steven Moffat’s seven-year tenure.

    In response, the BBC has decided the cure to The Doctor’s ails lies with the man who revived the show from a 15-year coma in 2005: Russell T. Davies. And with his first episode, last weekend’s hour-long special “The Star Beast,” Davies has delivered the goods. “The Star Beast” isn’t quite the reboot Davies is here to deliver — that’ll come in 2024 when Ncuti Gatwa takes over as The Fifteenth Doctor. Instead, “The Star Beast” is meant as catnip for lapsed and disappointed fans that were introduced during Davies’ first Who revival. It’s a blatant nostalgia play that, hilariously, carries on as if nothing has happened since Davies left the show in 2008. And you know what? It kills.

    Loosely based on “Doctor Who and The Star Beast,” a comics serial by Pat Mills and Watchmen co-creator Dave Gibbons, the new special pulls triple duty: delivering a snappy, classic Doctor Who adventure, introducing an overarching mystery that will tie “The Star Beast” to two more specials coming in following weeks, and briefly introducing the Doctor to newcomers. It excels at its first two tasks, and stumbles pretty extravagantly at the third. Luckily, there’s so much charm here that “The Star Beast” never feels anything other than delightful, even at its clumsiest.

    That charm is essential, because Davies’ first Doctor Who episode in 15 years is lampshading what, in most circumstances, would read as desperation. The mystery at the center of “The Star Beast” and the specials that follow is why — and how — did The Thirteenth Doctor (Jodie Comer) regenerate back into the same body she had as the Tenth Doctor (fan-favorite David Tennant). For a show built around a time-traveling humanoid alien who never dies but instead “regenerates” into a new body with a new personality so the show can explain away recasting its lead, “continuity” has always been more a suggestion than a rule. But Davies bringing back Tennant as the newly-christened Fourteenth Doctor and also Catherine Tate as beloved companion Donna Noble is extravagantly cheeky, even for this show.

    Image: Disney Plus

    What reunites them is the eponymous Star Beast, a giant Furby-lookin’ guy called The Meep, who crashes on Earth and befriends Donna’s daughter, Rose. The Meep is being hunted by insectoid soldiers who look like Power Rangers villains, catching Donna and her family in the crossfire and bringing The Doctor back into their lives again.

    It’s all very silly, and an astonishing display from two actors who do not seem to have missed a beat since they last played these roles in 2008. Even with its messy exposition and open, lavish courtship of fans that grew to love the show during the first Davies era, “The Star Beast” is a good reminder that Donna and The Tenth Doctor were popular for a very good reason. Doctor Who has never had the biggest budget or the slickest sensibilities; it was and remains a childrens’ show that fans happily carried into adulthood. The most beloved of Doctors — Tom Baker, Matt Smith, David Tennant, and a few wild card picks — made this text, imbuing the character with a childlike whimsy, playing a very old man who never stopped believing there was magic to be found in the universe.

    David Tennant is still remarkably good at this, and “The Star Beast” makes as good a case for The Doctor as any. He’s endlessly curious, always a little odd, and trusts that kindness and intelligence will win the day over violent antagonists. Tennant’s Doctor is not afraid to treat every square inch of ground as a stage from which he will play to the back of the room. There is no line too silly for him to bellow with conviction. There is no creature too strange for him to care about.

    The Doctor and Donna in the 60th Anniversary Doctor Who specials

    Image: Disney Plus

    “The Star Beast” takes a little bit longer to recapture what makes Donna Noble such a great presence, but when she finally gets going, Catherine Tate is a force of nature: Never that impressed with The Doctor, happy to argue with him even with armageddon on the line, and fully capable of steamrolling anyone who looks askance at her or her loved ones.

    It is hard not to love these two characters, to not want to travel all of time and space with them again. In a way we have, from 2008 to 2023, in a transition so seamless it’s shocking. Perhaps this shouldn’t be such a surprise. When Doctor Who is at its best, it’s like The Doctor has always been there: an old imaginary friend that still charms you as an adult. The earnest wonder and curiosity the character represents never really gets old. This is why the show endures: You don’t need a season of Doctor Who to be won over, you just need a moment. Those moments can come at any time, during runs both maligned and excellent. The Tenth Doctor and Donna Noble were incredibly good at making those moments in their time together. Here’s to a few more, before it’s someone else’s turn.

    The Doctor Who 60th Anniversary specials are on Disney Plus, with the first now streaming and two more premiering weekly. Previous seasons of Doctor Who are available to stream on Max.

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    Joshua Rivera

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