So what’s the greatest threat to Reddit, would you say, today? What’s the thing that keeps you up at night?
Regulation. TikTok.
Section 230 regulation [the US law that allows web operators to moderate content as they see fit]?
That’s a big one. I’m more worried about this just general trend in western democracies to be extremely anti-democratic. This desire for the government to control speech, which is effectively controlling what people can and can’t think.
What would be an example of that?
Look at the Twitter Files: the government literally controlling speech. I think speech and democracy are inseparable concepts, and Reddit is a democratic platform. It is controlled by voting for other people. I think the trend over the last few years is that, “People have too much power, people have too many opinions… Everything needs to come from central government or media controlled by the government.” That is a trend that is really alarming.
How does TikTok worry you?
Okay, there are two dimensions. One, the app when you make a video on TikTok, it’s recording, not just you, not just the video you think you’re making, but your face, your likeness, your voice, the voices of other people in the room, all the objects you have in the room, maybe where you are, the things in the background and other people going straight to a database controlled by a hostile foreign nation. Maybe the most hostile.
And if when people say that’s not happening, that is a ludicrous take. Or the idea that we’re going to store the data in the United States? That is laughable. Such a head fake, because all the algorithms run the show in Beijing.
That’s one dimension…
I can criticize other tech companies for maybe being greedy or clumsy. But lots of companies are greedy and clumsy. But in many or most cases, their heart is in the right place and they’re trying to do the right thing, which is difficult, and they do their best to live within the laws of the lands. I don’t think any of that is true of TikTok, they’re a Chinese company and don’t care about our laws. There’s zero accountability there.
So do you think TikTok should be banned?
Yes.
Okay. But you’ve just spent time talking about how free speech is important to you…
You think this attacks free speech? It’s the propaganda arm of the Chinese Communist Party. What’s free about it? It’s completely censored.
But you’re quite happy with that contradiction?
Social media is media, and the fastest-growing social media app is controlled by the Chinese Communist Party.
But it would benefit you if TikTok was banned?
Reddit will be fine with or without TikTok, with or without Facebook, Twitter… whatever. We’ve seen competitors start from small companies and turn into the world’s largest companies. We’ve been around 18 years and I’m not worried about competition. The only competition I worry about is our ability to build the best Reddit. We have sacrificed growth for our idealism, time and time again and we still survived. So yes, it’s easy to write what I’m saying off as coming from a self-interested tech guy. But I’m also a somewhat knowledgeable tech guy who can see what’s going on.
Robert Leedham
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